In retrospect Sandy Hook marked the end of the US gun control debate. Once America decided killing children was bearable, it was over.
— (((Dan Hodges))) (@DPJHodges) June 19, 2015
Thanks to globalization, we Americans live in a world where more and more of us have deep ties outside the United States. This can be terrifically enriching. In our kitchens we cook up international food, our fold-out couches host guests from around the world, our children might grow up speaking more than one language when we decide to procreate with that lovely research consultant we met while working on that localization project in the European Indian Southeast Asian subdivision. Darwin adores us for mixing it up.
“A man who called 911 to proclaim allegiance to the Islamic State terrorist group, and who had been investigated in the past for possible terrorist ties, stormed a gay nightclub here Sunday morning, wielding an assault rifle and a pistol, and carried out the worst mass shooting in United States history, leaving 50 people dead and 53 wounded.” — New York Times, June 12, 2016
But every now and then, we’ll find a cultural barrier that we just can’t break down. Our affection for peanut butter. Root beer. The excellent but rather culturally specific Mark Wahlberg movie, Boogie Nights. (“What is going on here?” “You really had to grow up in the US in the 70s to get this, honey, I’m sorry. Let’s watch Indiana Jones again instead.”) And our fondness for mass shootings. That’s right, that oh so American event when an armed gunman wreaks terror on an unsuspecting group of citizens in a public place — we like shopping malls, restaurants, and we’ve definitely taken a liking to schools. We’ve been known to put a workplace or post office on lockdown now and again, too. Churches and faith organizations aren’t immune, either. Hey, we don’t discriminate on religion when it comes to a mass shooting.
“The mass murder of nine people who gathered Wednesday night for Bible study at a landmark black church has shaken a city whose history from slavery to the Civil War to the present is inseparable from the nation’s anguished struggle with race.” — New York Times, June 18,2015
That’s when you, Globalized American, are struck with a need to explain. Maybe it’s to your in-laws, or the kid of the family you’re having dinner with in Austria, or just your snarky friends on social media that you’ve not met in real life, but you think of them as friends regardless. As an American with friends and family in civilized nations, when we experience a mass shooting, it’s very likely you’ll have to answer this question:
“What the fuck is wrong with you people?”
It’s tempting to respond by rationally educating your ignorant foreign friend. We blow the dust off the sacred Second Amendment, the Right to Bear Arms. We may queue up that Power Point presentation we keep handy about the American Revolution. We trot out the old adage about how it’s not guns that kill people, it’s people that kill people. We blame the media. We have a lot of handy arguments, and the NRA will give us all kinds of enriched material in order to help us continue to make these arguments. All this is very well-meaning, but it’s complicated and it takes a lot of time. You may still never get your non-American friends and family to understand the issues.
At least 50 people were killed in a mass shooting on the Las Vegas Strip, police said Monday. The shooting is deadliest in modern US history. – CNN, October 2, 2017
There’s a better way. A shortcut. The phone rings and it’s your cousin in Brisbane, Australia. She’s distraught, she’s just seen news of the fourth, no, fifth, no sixth, who can keep track, shooting in less than a week. She’s seriously reconsidering her trip to see you this summer because she’s scared. And she asks you that question:
“What the fuck is wrong with you people?”
Here’s your answer:
“We are assholes. We are out of our fucking minds. We think it’s more important to protect the “rights” of a guy who needs a semi-automatic weapon to go buy cookies at Target than it is to protect the lives of our children. We are such assholes that we sacrifice kindergarten kids and their teachers, we sacrifice college girls and boys, we sacrifice law enforcement officers while they eat their lunch.
Our government is so weak and selfish that they respond to these repeated events not with action, but by saying “Our thoughts are with the families of those affected,” when really their thoughts are in protecting their gun lobby money for reelection.
A gunman wearing body armor and carrying a rifle killed at least 19 children and two teachers at an elementary school in this Texas city on Tuesday, authorities said. — Washington Post, May 25, 2022
Given recent events and our utter lack of national will to legislate even the most reasonable of gun control initiatives, I can’t guarantee there’s not going to be another shooting tomorrow. I took a bunch of time off work for the duration of your visit, but you know what? Cancel your flights, I’m coming to see you in Brisbane instead. Wayne LaPierre in 2016, Dana Loesch Marjorie Taylor Greene in 2024, bitches!”
And that, friends, is how to talk to your foreign friends and family about American gun violence. Good luck and have a great time on your travels abroad.
Nothing but an emotional rant with no clear understanding as to why we have the right to be armed.
The U.S. Government nor the police is obligated to protect you. Both have made many poor decisions in recent times yet you blindly trust them? Why? (They can’t even handle the national deficit nor illegal immigration) World history has proven when governments regulate weapons they will eventually step on its own citizens for self preservation.
75% of the entire world’s weapons export is done by the U.S. Government, they make more in sales than all firearm sales done by U.S. citizens. ..yet you want them to regulate our firearms? Let’s not forget other countries….governments….strive for nuclear weapons simply to deter aggression..should not citizens have the same right?
Governments will come and go….people will remain and endure..especially in the U.S. because we have the U.S. Constitution.
Lastly….gun control does not work….20,000+ gun laws and shootings still happen. It’s gun EDUCATUON that’s needed.
We agree that education is needed. A very good place to start.
Wrong. Gun control in fact does work, and Australia is a good place for that first look.
“A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.”
For the grammatically challenged among you, which apparently includes the Supreme Court, the Second Amendment guarantees the right for a well-regulated militia. We have that. It’s called the National Guard.
For the conspiracy theorists among you who are convinced the government is out to get you, don’t you know the government is made up individuals, many of them your friends and family? Do you really think they are all out to get you? I pity those who live in fear – They’re called conservatives:
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-human-beast/201104/conservatives-big-fear-brain-study-finds
Where’s the like button? I need that. Now.
You got the punctuation wrong in the 2nd Amendment. You also interpret the clause “a well regulated militia” incorrectly. So, go back to school and learn it right. The 2nd Amendment as ratified is “A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.” The phrase “the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed” is not affected or conditions placed on it by the beginning phrases. And considering that is how the found fathers interpreted what they wrote, I’d say that was its intended meaning.
“For the grammatically challenged among you, which apparently includes the Supreme Court, the Second Amendment guarantees the right for a well-regulated militia.”
Apparently, you’re grammatically challenged, too! What luck, then, that I’m here to tell you you’re wrong.
“…the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed” is the key part here. It recognizes an individual right to bear arms, not a collective one vested in an entity that wouldn’t exist for over a hundred years after the Constitution was ratified.
“don’t you know the government is made up individuals, many of them your friends and family?”
This may be true, but “the government” is not an individual, and given the disastrous War on Drugs, I believe that government isn’t as virtuous as you think.
I’d love to see your constitutional scholar credentials.
Yes. Educatuon. Starting with spelling.
Actually, world history has not proven you correct at all. This world is full of countries where gun rights are restricted yet the people are free.
Do you really, honestly think you’d be able to hold off the US military if they came after you? Really? You and your semi-automatic are going to hold off fully automatic machine guns and tanks?
You are the problem. First, get an education “EDUCATUON”! Then please study about the civilized world, history and the law. Constantly citing the constitution without understanding it and the intent is ignorant. The constitution was written in a very different time, 1789 over 225+ years ago. The threat now is gun owners. The only thing I fear is uneducated gun nuts.
“World history has proven when governments regulate weapons they will eventually step on its own citizens for self preservation.”
Pretty much every other developed country in the world?
Yes. I have been trying to think all day of how to respond to the most recent shooting, thinking god, there seems to be one every day now. You just summed it up perfectly. I am SO sick and tired of all the crap about protecting our 2nd amendment rights and how guns don’t kill people, blah blah blah. It has to stop. I’m scared for the world that my 3 year old nephew and 5 year old niece will be growing up in if it doesn’t.
1. It is brave to post this.
2. It shouldn’t have to be.
3. You are right.
AGA
In addition to my right to bear arms, I have the right to free speech. I’m just exercising my rights.
Well put Pam, well put.
If Australia can have a mass shooting, change it’s laws and come out ahead, I don’t understand why we haven’t yet done the same.
Here’s the article I’m referencing: http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/dec/14/america-mass-murder-australia-gun-control-saves-lives
– T
Eighteen years ago, the night before I was moving from California to Utah I was having one last night of perfect pasta in San Francisco’s North Beach neighborhood, when on the way back to my car I was pushed up against a building.
I was looking down the barrel of a gun–all three of the men had guns pointing at me and my friend, and we were robbed. Thankfully, that’s all that happened. Thankfully we didn’t have our heads blown off. Thankfully, we weren’t yanked into their car to experience more horrors.
The following day one of my girlfriends said, “See? SEE? That’s why you should have been carrying a gun!”
No. A million times no. The second I’d reach for a gun I definitely would have had my head blown off. I knew that then and I know that still.
The minute that people start packing heat to rescue or save people they’ve escalated the situation even more. There’s a lot of tongue wagging with respect with the idea of moms carrying guns to protect their kids, but I’ve yet to see anyone actually understand how it works. (Or rather, it doesn’t.)
Great post, Pam. I’m confused why this debate about gun control and gun rights continues. Just utterly confused.
ps: I could also do away with the media coverage of these events, akin to ancient public spectacles of executions. While I appreciate the headlines upping the awareness (duh!) I believe we’ve reached the tipping point of perhaps, “Yawn. Another shooting.” And then: Nothing happens. Nothing.
Well said. Candid and biting. That you’ve provided a link to actionable involvement is brilliant. I’ll be sharing this for sure. Thanks.
It’s a well said and to the point summary of the reality of guns in today’s America. It’s all well and good to point to a centuries old Constitution and point to a centuries old war but the result of refusing to move forward is the death of innocents, time and again.
I once argued that the only way the situation in the USA will ever change, is when (like the father of boy who was a victim of the recent shooting in California) people decide that they value the lives of their children more than they value the right for everyone to own a weapon whose sole purpose is the taking of human life.
First of all, if this country sucks so bad, why are there millions of people scrambling to get in? Second, why do we care what persons from other countries think when, as you made abundantly clear, there is no possible way they could understand? And third, as soon as our “Police make whatever inquiries they think necessary to inform the decision on whether (or under what conditions) the license should be granted” you libs will FREAK out. Tell me, what’s your plan to get rid of 330 milllion registered guns (and millions more here illegally)? I’m all ears.
1. Two different arguments. I’m not discussing immigration here, I’m discussing mass shootings.
2. “We” may not care, but *I* do, tremendously. I have non-American family. That’s why I wrote this.
3. Actually, “we libs” are not, just like you “non-libs” homogeneous. I’m okay with background checks for gun buyers. That’s one liberal. I’m not alone in being willing to make this concession.
4. I didn’t actually suggest we “get rid of guns.” I favor licensing, insurance, registration, and education. And were I to have to make the plan, I might start with asking, and then, implementing the kind of programs Australia used to reign in their gun problem.
Pam, Nicely written article but so one sided. I am a licensed gun owner and therefore a registered gun owner. I have been trained by one of the best in the country and I don’t need to buy insurance as my gun is my insurance and I, as well as 99% of the gunowners in this country, do not intend to go on a mass shooting tirade. You failed to mention several things that all anti-gun proponents constantly forget. The government already has a background checking system in place. I was checked five times! In one year! – once when I purchased the gun, three times when I got my concealed carry permits from three states and once again before the training company would accept my application. The problem is an incompetent government that fails to do its job on background checking. Next, the vast majority of people who commit crimes with guns never went through a background check because they got the guns illegally. Finally, every mass shooter since the Texas Tower massacre was on drugs – EVERY ONE OF THEM! What are you and the government doing about that? NOTHING! The people want their kids drugged because they can’t control them (when I was a kid my parents controlled their six kids and there we didn’t go on mass shootings). The drug companies continue to push their drugs on our kids, our teens, our soldiers, etc., and protect their “right” to do so with their large profits paying off government officials and our congress men and women. The gun control you speak of in Australia and England and Canada doesn’t reveal all the truth. Crimes increased in many of these countries using other weapons. I believe it is Switzerland that issues guns to all citizens and they are virtually crime free! So, while I certainly feel for all the deaths from mass shootings and want to stop them even more so then you, it won’t happen until you and others fight the real fight against an incompetent government system and against drug companies.
Thanks for the reasonable voice from the gun owning side. I have questions/comments.
1. You may feel your weapon insures your own safety, but what protects those who are victims of its misuse?
2. Are you arguing that permits should be federal? I also have to get a new driver’s license if I move to a new state, and marriage laws still differ from state to state. I do think that many issues we legislate at a state level should be federal now — this concept is dated.
3. Bad parenting is indeed responsible for a lot of tragically suffering humans, sure, but what would happen if those mentally ill humans found it extremely difficult to acquire a gun? I don’t think we can blame bad parenting across the board, and sometimes, good parents have kids who make very bad decisions or, sadly are mentally ill.
4. I don’t think the pharma lobby is full of angels either, sure, but that’s really a different discussion.
5. Crime went up with other weapons after gun control because people turned to weapons other than guns. Okay. Sure. That makes sense. But how many mass shootings were there? That’s what I’m talking about here.
6. What you say about Switzerland isn’t entirely accurate — they issue weapons to men between the ages of 20-30 while they’re in the state militia. They then can opt to keep their weapon, but they must have a permit. It’s worth noting that the Swiss are regulation crazy, hoo boy. A Swiss style system in the US? Do you think that would fly here? We’d have to start with a draft, it seems.
Very well written and spot on! This is one of the biggest reasons I dread coming back to the US after living abroad for almost 2 years. People just way to frothy that they are unable to see the damage we are inflicting on our children and society.
Just yesterday we sent this to every state and federal legislator who represents us. I am a graduate of Virginia Tech & a retired elementary school principal, and I have certainly had enough!
“So, (Name of Legislator), have you had enough yet, or are you still willing to be complicit in the continued massacre of children at school and citizens in the workplace? Is our country actually a democracy or just a wholly owned subsidiary of the NRA? The overwhelming majority of Americans want reasonable, common sense legislation that would expand background checks, close gun show loopholes, and ban assault weapons and high capacity magazines. We also want improved funding for those who are mentally ill, and a system that ensures that those folks can’t buy guns. What we continue to get, however, from our state and federal legislators is NOTHING. In the meantime, the killing continues. Have we truly become a society in which a school shooting is a weekly occurrence and we are powerless to do anything about it because our legislators are so afraid of the NRA and the gun nuts in our country? We urge you to have the courage to stand up and say “Enough! We can no longer tolerate this and surely there is something we can do.” We are only two voters, but we most assuredly are not the only two who feel this way. We want to assure you that we will contribute to lobbying groups that support reasonable gun laws. We will encourage everyone we know to do the same, and on Election Day, we will only vote for candidates who are courageous enough to begin to do something to stop this madness. Surely, you must know that our Founding Fathers could not possibly have envisioned this when they wrote the Second Amendment…”
Amen, Pam!
Registration are licensing are non-starters for people of arms and with good reason. It would help to understand the people and the rationales, the logical and moral underpinnings of private gun ownership, instead of tilting at windmills, whether it’s the ‘gun lobby,’ ‘gun industry,’ Republicans, etc. So much of the rancor against guns is uninformed and one-sided.
What, exactly, is that good reason that they’re non-starters? You don’t provide it here.
We need to discuss ‘violence’ as opposed to ‘gun violence.’ We are missing the real issue.
I think they are part of the same problem, and I absolutely agree that a lowering of ALL violence in our society would be very welcome.
The US does not have a corner on homicides or suicides. Our press would lead one to believe it so.
Check Mexico, Japan, India, England etc.
Google ‘glassing’ or ‘steak knives’ in the U.K.
Stop comparing apples to oranges.
I’m not comparing anything. I’m saying my European friends do not understand our mass shootings. There are a lot of horrible crimes, I am talking about one specific type of crime that we *do* seem to have a corner on.
Also, seriously? Ewwww. No. How is looking up other horrible crimes a helpful thing to suggest?
Well, lookie here! I Googled stabbings, USA, and got this: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-26959628 22 injuries. Your addiction to the gun doesn’t cure your habit of other forms of violence, either.
The difference between someone going on a rampage with a broken glass or a knife and someone going on a rampage with a gun is that, typically, nobody dies.
Kunming China is China-specific. I’ve been in that station, and been in that station when it’s busy, and when it’s busy, and there’s a train coming in, you physically cannot move more than few centimetres. That would have escalated to hundreds of deaths with guns. But it didn’t, because China, like the UK, has gun control.
You know, the US is not the only place with random wanton violence. A couple weeks ago there were two bomb explosions in Southern Thailand that killed and maimed people. Nobody batted an eye. Sure, places like Australia and the EU might have bad, freaky impressions of the US, but that’s just because the US is a prominent feature of the news, whereas the media rarely comments on how many people died today by gunfire in say, Somalia.
This is a false equivalency. Thailand just had a coup and Somalia, that place has been a complete and total mess since… when, exactly? Should we compare ourselves with nations in turmoil? Because we can do that and relinquish our claim on stability. However…
We have a sitting government, we’re not under military rule, we’re not in the grips of civil war. And the media DOES comment on war deaths, regularly, though we seem to be the only nation not at war that has regular killing sprees.
Thailand’s recent coup was in Bangkok and it was not violent. The bombings and explosions are a daily occurrence in the southern provinces like Yala and Pattani and are committed by Muslim extremists (Same as Somalia). That’s just Islamists being Islamists, so it doesn’t apply here. But there are also frequent, non-political shooting attacks by regular Thais, usually due to loss of face. Events like this one are not uncommon:
http://www.chiangmaicitynews.com/news.php?id=3884
Hell, my Thai girlfriend experienced a shooting spree outside her shop in Isaan just a couple of years ago (2 dead – a relationship gone bad) and took crime scene photos for the police. (Incidentally, the same girlfriend’s friend was murdered the same year in another violent attack). I’m told that there is at least 1 shooting of this type a week in Thailand.
The world (let alone Americans) do not hear about even a small fraction of what’s going on in other countries, so to single the US out as the ONLY place where these kinds of attacks occur with such frequency, just because you don’t see international killing sprees plastered over on the nightly news with the underlying agenda of gun control, is a bit naive, it not uninformed. Americans have nothing to gain or lose over gun control laws in Thailand, Somalia, or any other place, so why would the news report about about that with as much fanfare as it does when it covers a US shooting spree (even if the same number of victims, or more, were killed)?
You seem to be suggesting that because there is gun violence in Thailand, we should accept it here.
I certainly think it would be good for the world to be educated on global issues, and sure, why shouldn’t those issues be Thailand’s growing gun violence problem. But I don’t understand your point. Are you defending the US inaction on guns because “it happens other places too, so whatever?” Or are you saying that Thailand needs better gun laws? Because it kind of looks that way.
And while gun violence may be increasing in other places in the world, the US is the only nation at peace where we see mass shootings on a regular basis.
Wrong, Pam.
the US is indeed under military rule, and we do have a low-simmering civil war going on.
Expect the low simmer to crank up as the ultra-rich continue to strip mine all the country’s assets, and impoverish & imprison many more.
‘Freedom’ is just another word for “ain’t got nothing to lose”
“A couple weeks ago there were two bomb explosions in Southern Thailand that killed and maimed people. Nobody batted an eye. ”
The reference has nothing to do with this piece about out of control (not so random, opportunistic) gun violence in the US; it was another instance of a bombing by religious extremists, which actually occurred two months ago hurting several people but killing no one. The claim that ‘nobody batted an eye’ must mean the event wan’t covered by US media, because it was widely covered in Thailand.
The US is a prominent feature of the news partly because of the gun violence there.
Peter Bouvier
Thailand
What a silly, emotional article. You want to come to Brisbane, Australia? You should know that violent assaults have increased in Australia by approximately 40% and sexual assaults by 20% since gun laws were tightened here in the mid 90’s.
Worst of all, we Australians have absolutely no recourse to defend ourselves against home invasions, violent attacks, etc. There was a case where a person’s home was invaded and the owner was attacked with a samurai sword.The owner managed to wrestle the sword from the attacker and fatally stab him. He called an ambulance but the attacker died regardless. The home owner was charged because he was armed and the attacker was not. To classify as “self-defense” in Australia both men would have had to have samurai swords, or the owner would need to have a smaller weapon, capable of inflicting less damage, like a knife. An utterly ridiculous situation that endangers us all. If someone is met with hostile intent, they should have whatever means is necessary to defend their life and get the job done. Should we also ban cars since they have the potential to be used as missiles? How about private plane ownership?
Please don’t assume that everyone abroad applies the same emotional, non-logic as you to US gun-rights. Killers are going to kill regardless of gun accessibility. Be it via finding a way to obtain guns illegally, or carrying out a series of non-violent serial killings over a longer time period like the Tylenol murders.
Oh, and even Obama sends his own kids to a school with armed guards. Gun right ownership is not something that’s going to change in the US.
Silly argument indeed. Just as silly as suggesting that there’s a direct relationship between the implementation of aggressive gun control and the increase in violent crime. Another silly argument? Appealing to fear — if I don’t have a gun, how will I defend myself WHEN my home is invaded. Creating a culture of fear perpetuates fallacies like this.
I live in Australia and this is completely accurate. We are utterly baffled at your crazy laws and refusal to do anything about it.
THANK YOU. That is all.
It’s a country where 70% of the population believes in angels, evolution. Global Warming is a myth.
Faith=believing in things with no basis in proof. Being a ‘person of faith’ should equal ‘insane, delusional’.
Here, the only thing that will stop gun violence is MOAR GUNZ.
Sorta like the only thing which will stop gasoline/petrol station fires is more spillage.
Assholes, indeed.
Word. Right on Pam.
You’re incredible. I love you for this. And admire you, so deeply. I was in America back in 2010, in a mall and suddenly I had this thought, ‘Oh fuck, I’m in a shopping mall in the States’, and I was incredibly uncomfortable. I’ve lived in Istanbul, been to Cairo, was really scared in a shopping in America. Thank you for having the courage to say this in a land where people appear to be too afraid to speak out as their babies and loved ones are slaughtered. To scared, it seems, of the idiots and bullies who will crash down on them for speaking a truth that is so evident to the rest of the world.
Much love and respect.
Di
Thanks for this, Pam. The United States is indeed broken, where a the gun manufacturer’s lobby has created a culture of fear and violence. Anyone who is a member of the NRA should be ashamed of themselves, but they won’t be, because the NRA has convinced them that guns are their religion.
I expect that at this point, gun owners have pretty much permanently fucked up our country.
Really picky point of contention Ron — I’m not actually blanket anti-gun-owners. My husband comes from a nation where hunting is still very much part of the culture and that moderated my view somewhat. I’d say that the blame rests squarely on the NRA and those unwilling to promote a moderate, reasonable approach.
The husband said that in Austria, you have to have a license and training to own hunting weapons, a job that requires you to carry a handgun to own one of those (security, military) and no one BUT the military is allowed semi-automatics. That seems awfully reasonable.
I’m traveling in Argentina right now. Many people I meet say, “Be careful. Those _other_ people are bad.” They don’t understand that, as long as I’m reasonably cautious (try to avoid bad neighborhoods, don’t flash large rolls of cash) Argentina is much safer than the US.
Hi Pam,
With regards to the Australian gun control laws, that some commenters have mentioned:
“The fact is that the introduction of those laws did not result in any acceleration of the downward trend in gun homicide. They may have reduced the risk of mass shootings but we cannot be sure because no one has done the rigorous statistical work required to verify this possibility. It is always unpleasant to acknowledge facts that are inconsistent with your own point of view. But I thought that was what distinguished science from popular prejudice.” – New South Wales Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research, Don Weatherburn
Perhaps the answer to solving these tragedies is not the law.
By all reports, Australia has had no mass shootings since 1996 when they enacted the reform.
There have also been no mass shootings since that time in New Zealand, even though they that didn’t enact reform.
The answer is to take away guns from law abiding citizens who take gun ownership safely, respectfully and with all the proper training?
For every nut out there looking to do harm with a firearm there are multitudes that own and carry guns for all the right reasons! Do you really believe laws will keep guns out of criminals hands?
Disarmament of honest law abiding citizens will mean one thing. Only criminals will have Firearms.
Also, if your going to reference the second amendment, study it and get your facts straight.
How many crimes are stopped each day by an honorable gun carrier? You rarely if ever hear those statistics! Do your homework in its entirety before posting such misinformed and misleading statements! I carry a gun proudly, responsibly and very safely. You and people like you have no right to try disarm the honest citizens of these United States!
I for one would have been car jacked and likely killed one day in Dorchester Ma. if I had not been armed.
Your argument shows your ramped up emotion, not a sensible regard of truth.
I pray the day never comes when you have to thank a legal, honest gun carrier for saving your life. I imagine that will be a hard pill for you to swallow!
My argument is, indeed, appeal to emotion (as is all of yours) little else seems to get anyone’s attention.
I like data, though, and there’s plenty to show that restricted access to firearms results in a decrease in gun crime, including in Australia — the government publishes their homicide data annually, it’s easy to find. There are 27 amendments to the Constitution — it’s not legal to own slaves anymore, for example — proving that the Constitution can be amended. I do believe laws work, stop signs do, and speed limits, and while not everyone observes all the laws all the time, they’re necessary for a civil society.
A lot of what I hear boils down to “No way you’re taking away my gun,” which seems like “ramped up emotion, not a sensible regard of truth.” I’m unlikely to attempt to wrest a gun from someone who’s armed, seems like a good way to get shot. I’d prefer to limit those odds by also limiting the sheer number of guns around.
A lot of silly arguments here by people who should know better. We want an all powerful state to protect us, but experience has shown that not only does the all powerful state not protect us, it uses its power to oppress and kill us.
One poster wrote that he was “unlikely to wrest a gun from someone who’s armed”; but left unsaid what he would do – send a heavily armed swat team to kill that person if he didn’t comply with their idea of “reasonable gun control”. That’s what panics people about gun control – the idea that gun control proponents are willing to kill them and their families over this issue, and they have already done so many, many, times.
Um, nope. I can’t speak for everyone, but I’d rather my neighbors not have the kinds of tools the Vegas shooter had access to. I have yet to understand why every call for regulation is met with extreme scenarios when what we’d like are screening, education, insurance requirements, licencing, and restricted access to weapons for mass murder.
For the record, I *do* want to take away the guns. There are far too many of them in the hands of people who have no respect for the damage they do.
So, you do want to take away guns. How? Behind your talk of screening, education, insurance requirements, licencing, and restricted access, is the “or else”, the use of deadly force on those who do not comply. You’re no different than the Vegas shooter; you don’t care who gets hurt, and the ends justifies the means.
I’m “no different from the Vegas shooter.” Uh huh.